Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.

30 December 1941. Rangoon, Burma.
30 December 1941. Rangoon, Burma.

The men of 20th Indian Brigade marched out of the port and onto a train to take them to Pegu where 10th Indian Division was being concentrated. The men had been brought to Burma onboard RMS Queen Mary, along with the Division’s artillerymen, engineers and the rest of the men that made up a Division’s fighting ability. The men of 21st and 25th Brigades had sailed on RMS Queen Elizabeth. The two troopships normally ploughed the sea between Australia and the Gulf of Aden. The need to bring the 10th Indian Division to Burma as speedily as possible had meant a detour to Basra. Standing off Rangoon because of the threat of air attack, the men had been transhipped onto other smaller vessels to carry on into the port. General Auchinleck had to fight tooth and nail for the 10th Division to be sent to Burma. With the fighting in Malaya, Percival had been hoping for this Indian Division on top of the recently arrived Australian 9 Division and British 18th Division. General Alexander, newly appointed as GOC Burma Army, had won the argument with the War Office that this Division was crucial to his plan to hold Burma. This, along with Auchinleck’s interventions, had been accepted.

Some of the ships normally used in the Mediterranean between Alexandria and Tobruk and in the Red Sea between Port Sudan and the Suez Canal had been sent to pick up 10th Division’s equipment. These ships, with various escorts, were already in the Bay of Bengal and expected to arrive within the week. Among the equipment was 252nd Indian Armoured Brigade’s mix of light tanks, some well-travelled Vickers A9s and A10s, armoured cars, and 14th/20th King's Hussars’ had M3 Stuart tanks.

Major-General Bill Slim and some of his staff had been in Rangoon for a week trying to sort out all the practicalities of moving and training a Division from one theatre to another. Major-General Arthur Wakely’s 7th Indian Division already had two of its Brigades in Burma. The 13th Brigade had been under the command of the Burma Division. The 16th Brigade was finally complete with all three Battalions concentrated at Mandalay. With the arrival of 14th Brigade, and the Divisional Troops, Wakely, like Slim was trying to get his Division sorted out. The arrival of General Harold Alexander was expected within a day or two. He was currently in Calcutta with General Auchinleck being briefed on the situation, especially about the need to work with the Chinese to keep the Burma Road open.

The other problem that Slim had to deal with was the likelihood that he would be promoted to Lieutenant-General and be put in charge of a newly formed Burma Corps. Slim had requested that General Auchinleck appoint Brigadier Douglas Gracey from 17th Indian Brigade in Iraq to take over as GOC 10th Indian Division. Slim was also aware that a Corps would need a lot more staff that were currently on hand. Auchinleck had negotiated with Wavell to give Alexander help with staff, on top of what he could spare himself from India. Slim had been promised that he would have a proportion of those staff officers when they arrived.

In the meantime, Slim and Wakely had visited Major-General Charles Fowkes (GOC 11th African Division) whose HQ was near Moulmein. They also met with Major-General James Scott (GOC 1st Burma Division). Losing 13th Indian Brigade, Scott was now facing the question about how his two remaining Burmese Brigades would be used. Without Harold Alexander’s input, Slim wasn’t able to say for definite. He admitted that frankly he would like Scott’s men to spend some more time training, both themselves and especially training new arrivals in getting to know, and not fear, the Burmese jungle. Slim was also aware that both Wakely and his men would need translators and local guides. Having some of the Burma Rifles or police on hand would prove very useful.

In discussions among the generals, it became clear to Slim that native Burmans made up a very small percentage of the Burmese forces. Scott noted that his forces (army, police, frontier, auxiliaries, territorials) had over 27000 men, but of that less than 4000 were Burmans. The largest contingent were Indians (over 10000), with substantial numbers of Karens, Chins and Kachins (just under 10000). Scott confirmed what Slim had already been advised by Lieutenant-General Donald McLeod, outgoing GOC (Burma Army), that the political temperature between the various nationalities within Burma was rising. There was a strong independence movement amongst the Burmans, influenced by Gandhi’s Congress Party in India. McLeod’s police had evidence that this was being supported and promoted by the Japanese. There was a real fear that this movement would work at undermining the defence of the country, especially in providing the Japanese with translators and guides. It was even possible that there would be a threat from fifth column activities. All of this made Slim and Wakely keen to enlist Scott’s help to procure reliable locals to support the two Indian formations.

Slim and Wakely were then informed of the existence of the Bush Warfare School at Maymyo officially known as Mission 204 or ‘Tulip Force’. This had been founded to train Australian and British troops in guerrilla warfare for the British Military Mission to China. The secrecy surrounding it came from the time when support for the Chinese was kept as hidden as possible so that there would be no justification for a Japanese attack on the British Empire. Major Michael Calvert was forming his trainees into three Special Service Detachments, or Commandoes. These were all small forces, but available to Slim and Alexander. Calvert was keen on using these commandoes as the Long Range Desert Group had been used in North Africa. The use of irregular troops in the East African campaign had played an interesting role, especially Gideon Force, not one that Slim was terribly keen on, but open to.

Slim was also introduced to the existence of the Oriental Mission, which had been founded in Singapore in May 1941 as the regional headquarters of the Ministry of Economic Warfare. Force 136, as it was known, was designed to conduct espionage, sabotage and reconnaissance in British territories that might be occupied by an enemy. Slim was informed that they were supporting Lt Col Noel Stevenson who had begun to organise levies from amongst the Karen tribesmen in the Shan States. Stevenson had served with the Burma Frontier Service and had extensive experience of working with the Karens. There was little time, few resources and next to no equipment, but many Karens were being organised to keep watch on Japanese movements and to identify Burmese collaborators. These two pieces of information made Slim realise why General Alexander had asked for Brigadier Orde Wingate to be attached to Burma Command.

Slim noted that having some kind of intelligence gathering system would be crucial and made a note to speak to Alexander about setting up some kind of organisation to provide his Corps with timely and accurate information about Japanese activities and intentions.

As he was new to the area, Slim had paid particular attention to the fact that there was a very limited road network and the railway ran north to south rather than east to west. Slim knew the 11th African Division from East Africa and noted their lower-than-normal establishment of motor vehicles. This was a double-edged issue. On one side, they weren’t tied to the roads so much. On the other side, their movement would be generally slower than a Division with the full allocation of Motor Transport. Slim was interested in how both the Burma Brigades, and the Africans were using more in the way of mules for resupply. Looking at the country, he could see the logic of having ‘all-terrain’ means of getting ammunition, water and rations to units.

The logistics of supporting a force in the east of Burma were going to be difficult. The vast rivers that flowed north to south were useful barriers against an invasion, but the limited bridges and ferries hampered supplying the defenders. There was an obvious danger of traffic jams along the limited roads waiting to cross rivers. This would be an invitation to the Japanese bombers to do great damage with little effort. Slim and Wakely would have to sit down with their staffs and work out how best to make sure the men had adequate supplies at all times.

When the problems had begun in Iraq earlier in the year, the initial forces had been flown into Basra by RAF transports. Slim knew very well the importance of air support, not only in defending troops against the enemy’s bombers, and in attacking the enemy’s troops, but also in re-supplying forces in emergencies. The RAF’s weakness in Burma was a real concern, one that needed more bombers, fighters and transport aircraft. This was out of Slim’s hands, but again something to discuss with Alexander when he arrived.

Something else that would need to be discussed was the threat of malaria and other diseases that would hamper the fighting power of the Indian troops. Slim had been informed by Brigadier Eric Lang, (Director of Medical Services) about the struggles to increase the levels of medical support for the growing army in Burma. Slim knew very well that the health of the troops, keeping the men fit and healthy, would have massive benefits, as would keeping up their morale. While getting more men and equipment was always going to be important, looking after the men and equipment already present was just as important. Until such time as all the reinforcements arrived, Slim had to take as much care for the men under his command as possible.

Finally, Slim and Wakely were shown the picture of what Lt-General McLeod’s staff had identified the two most likely routes that the Japanese would take if they did indeed invade. The Southern Shan States were crucial to the protection of the Burma Road to China. The fear was a thrust north eastwards into the Southern Shan States from the Chiengrai-Chiangmai area of Thailand. There were relatively good land communications inside Thailand towards the Burma frontier. Although the routes across the frontier itself were limited to tracks, once inside Burma the Japanese could head straight for the roads on the Tachilek - Keng-Tung –Thazi and the Mongpan-Thazi routes. The 1st Burma Infantry Brigade and the 13th Indian Infantry Brigade were in the Southern Shan States, along with the Burma Frontier Force columns, F.F.3 and F.F.4 protecting that route, with the other two Brigades of 7th Indian Division concentrating at Mandalay from where they could act in defence of the Burma Road.

The other possibility was an attack across the Dawna Hills into Tenasserim, followed by a drive aimed at Rangoon. The 2nd Burma Infantry Brigade, with F.F.2, defended Tenasserim, with significant garrisons at Moulmein, Tavoy and Mergui. This was where the 11th African Division had been sent to man the main line of defence at the Salween River, which was to be held at all costs. Slim’s 10th Indian Division, concentrating at Pegu would back up the 11th African Division. McLeod believed that the difficult border terrain and lack of adequate roads would preclude any serious attack in that direction.

Slim also was informed that the Chinese had offered to send two armies to help defend Burma, the Fifth and Sixth, each about the equivalent on size of a British division but with far less equipment. Auchinleck had accepted this offer but at first wanted these troops to remain inside China but close to the border with Burma where they would provide a reserve until Japanese intentions were revealed. Liaison was established with the Chinese, and it was agreed that one regiment of Chinese troops would move up to the Burma border early in December 1941. This unit was to be available to move into Burma to support the British in the event of a Japanese attack into the Southern Shan States. Auchinleck had agreed for the Chinese 227th Regiment of the Chinese 93rd Division to take over the defence of the Mekong River east of the Kengtung-Mongpyak road, relieving some pressure on Scott’s 1st Burma Brigade.

When General Alexander arrived, there was a great deal to be resolved and finalised. Slim could see some of the potential pitfalls and was reassured by some of his assets. The longer the Japanese delayed invading Burma, the longer the British Empire Forces would have time to prepare. Slim was keen to get to work on making the most of the time he had.

FF Detachments - December 1941.jpg

Map from
here
 
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The UK wasn't bankrupt at the end of WW1. Was it in extreme debt? Yes. It would have been able to service that debt a hell of a lot easier if the following hadn't happened:
1) Post war austerity by the government. Businesses needed to be able to transition back to a peacetime footing, as did the public. Austerity made that transition so very much harder. Austerity ALWAYS worsens an economic recession/depression, because spending money is what drives an economy.
2) Ironically, accepting German war reparations, both in cash and in kind. These placed British goods at a disadvantage because the German versions were practically free in comparison. Why buy British when you can buy far cheaper from Germany.
3) Which just reinforced the traditional viewpoint of the British investment banking sector that it was far more profitable investing offshore. Like, for example, investing in German industries over British ones desperately in need of finance, who thus lagged further and further behind.
4) A lot of that debt was taken up on behalf of, or as a result of acting as a guarantor for, Britain's allies, many of whom either defaulted on, or repudiated, those loans. Looking at you Russia/Soviet Union.

Ditto WW2. Britain had the ability to pay for virtually anything it required or to service its loans, IF it could pay in Sterling. However, the USA would only accept payments in dollars, which the UK ran out of. It still had a shit load of other money though. The US also refused to loan money as per WW1, due to the aforementioned loan defaults & repudiations, despite the UK not having done either, hence Lend-Lease. This brings us to the often overlooked trade clauses of Lend-Lease, which severely restricted British trade both during and post war, and which were designed to financially cripple the Empire, leading to its dissolution and replacement by an American mercantile one. Yay, state sponsored capitalism! Furthermore, the UK is practically the only country from either war that the US insisted pay its debts from WW1 & 2, which it finally did only a few years ago. Hell, even Germany got its WW1 loans forgiven before WW2.
 
30 December 1941. Rangoon, Burma.

Map from
here
I'm assuming the map is OTL, since it doesn't mention most of the units covered in the update. Does a good job of showing how OTL's defence amounted to little more than a thin screen of colonial militia in most places, with the only regulars stuck awkwardly in the Shan States with not much covering the gap between them and their supply base at Rangoon. TTL, they have the 11th African holding the Salween river north of Moulmein and are probably a lot happier. Slim is still going to have to deal with the problem that, with the ongoing fighting in Malaya, his units are going to be bottom of the priority list for everything.

Question about the map - does the railway line depicted running west from Bangkok and then NW through the Thailand/Burma border to join the Burmese network just south of Moulmein exist TTL? I thought that was the infamous Burma Railway that the Japanese began construction of after the occupation of Burma?

And one typo - it's Gandhi, not "Ghandi". And a note for people who got confused on the first read-through (like I did) - "Burmans" refers specifically to the majority ethnic group in Burma; "Burmese" to all inhabitants of Burma, including groups like the Karen, Chins, Kachins etc. OTL, the Burmans tended to be anti-British and most of the minority groups tended to be anti-Burman.
 
Losing the Malay tin and rubber was a huge economic hit OTL that looks likely to be at least partially avoided TTL. That alone will have overall British borrowing at least 10% lower.


Does it really matter if you're "only" £1 Million in debt rather than £3 Million? You're still bankrupt.
 
Does it really matter if you're "only" £1 Million in debt rather than £3 Million? You're still bankrupt.
If you are £3 Million in debt at 2% interest you need to find £60,000 a year just to meet the interest payments. If you are £2.7 Million in debt, you meet to find £54,000 a year. Which means that you have £60,000 a year to spend on other things.
 
If you are £3 Million in debt at 2% interest you need to find £60,000 a year just to meet the interest payments. If you are £2.7 Million in debt, you meet to find £54,000 a year. Which means that you have £60,000 a year to spend on other things.
Don't you mean £6,000 a year to spend on other things?
 

Mark1878

Donor
If you are £3 Million in debt at 2% interest you need to find £60,000 a year just to meet the interest payments. If you are £2.7 Million in debt, you meet to find £54,000 a year. Which means that you have £60,000 a year to spend on other things.
Also it is not the debt that matters it is how well you can service it. Britain's rise to power was because it could borrow lots of money and cheaper than its opponents.
You don't have to pay off debts quickly.

The UK did not finish paying off Seven Years War and Napoleonic war debt until 2014. This was because until then the existing debt had a lower interest rate than new debt. The last 15 years have been very unusual in money markets.
 
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due to the aforementioned loan defaults & repudiations, despite the UK not having done either
Technically the UK did default on a significant portion of their US war debt. The US government offered a one year moratorium on payments in 1932 and Britain, along with most other nations covered, never actually resumed payments. Most economic commenters, on both sides of the Atlantic, viewed this as a justified default as Loan payments had been tied to German reparations which the US ended early. But it is still technically a default. And the US Government may have had this in mind when it came to WW2.

Also, though not described as such at the time, when Chamberlain reissued the WW1 domestic bond debt at a lower interest rate in the 30’s this would be considered a default by modern definitions, though probably it was not seen as such at the time.
 
Technically the UK did default on a significant portion of their US war debt. The US government offered a one year moratorium on payments in 1932 and Britain, along with most other nations covered, never actually resumed payments. Most economic commenters, on both sides of the Atlantic, viewed this as a justified default as Loan payments had been tied to German reparations which the US ended early. But it is still technically a default. And the US Government may have had this in mind when it came to WW2.

Also, though not described as such at the time, when Chamberlain reissued the WW1 domestic bond debt at a lower interest rate in the 30’s this would be considered a default by modern definitions, though probably it was not seen as such at the time.
Reinhardt & Rogoff in their book on sovereign defaults did include the domestic debt restructuring as a default. Oddly, IIRC, they didn't include the default on the WW1 debts to the US.
 
Huh couldn't Slim and Auk use the massive labour pool they have and start building brick roads? I mean they did it OTL in 44 it would be worth considering even if it can't take heavy stuff it would speed up movement on foot.
 
Usually lower debt levels also mean lower interest rates as there is less implies risk ...so assuming the UK borrowed less, their debt servicing costs would be lower for two reasons.
 
30 December 1941. Rangoon, Burma.

The men of 20th Indian Brigade marched out of the port and onto a train to take them to Pegu where 10th Indian Division was being concentrated. The men had been brought to Burma onboard RMS Queen Mary, along with the Division’s artillerymen, engineers and the rest of the men that made up a Division’s fighting ability. The men of 21st and 25th Brigades had sailed on RMS Queen Elizabeth. The two troopships normally ploughed the sea between Australia and the Gulf of Aden. The need to bring the 10th Indian Division to Burma as speedily as possible had meant a detour to Basra. Standing off Rangoon because of the threat of air attack, the men had been transhipped onto other smaller vessels to carry on into the port. General Auchinleck had to fight tooth and nail for the 10th Division to be sent to Burma. With the fighting in Malaya, Percival had been hoping for this Indian Division on top of the recently arrived Australian 9 Division and British 18th Division. General Alexander, newly appointed as GOC Burma Army, had won the argument with the War Office that this Division was crucial to his plan to hold Burma. This, along with Auchinleck’s interventions, had been accepted.

Some of the ships normally used in the Mediterranean between Alexandria and Tobruk and in the Red Sea between Port Sudan and the Suez Canal had been sent to pick up 10th Division’s equipment. These ships, with various escorts, were already in the Bay of Bengal and expected to arrive within the week. Among the equipment was 252nd Indian Armoured Brigade’s mix of light tanks, some well-travelled Vickers A9s and A10s, armoured cars, and 14th/20th King's Hussars’ had M3 Stuart tanks.

Major-General Bill Slim and some of his staff had been in Rangoon for a week trying to sort out all the practicalities of moving and training a Division from one theatre to another. Major-General Arthur Wakely’s 7th Indian Division already had two of its Brigades in Burma. The 13th Brigade had been under the command of the Burma Division. The 16th Brigade was finally complete with all three Battalions concentrated at Mandalay. With the arrival of 14th Brigade, and the Divisional Troops, Wakely, like Slim was trying to get his Division sorted out. The arrival of General Harold Alexander was expected within a day or two. He was currently in Calcutta with General Auchinleck being briefed on the situation, especially about the need to work with the Chinese to keep the Burma Road open.

The other problem that Slim had to deal with was the likelihood that he would be promoted to Lieutenant-General and be put in charge of a newly formed Burma Corps. Slim had requested that General Auchinleck appoint Brigadier Douglas Gracey from 17th Indian Brigade in Iraq to take over as GOC 10th Indian Division. Slim was also aware that a Corps would need a lot more staff that were currently on hand. Auchinleck had negotiated with Wavell to give Alexander help with staff, on top of what he could spare himself from India. Slim had been promised that he would have a proportion of those staff officers when they arrived.

In the meantime, Slim and Wakely had visited Major-General Charles Fowkes (GOC 11th African Division) whose HQ was near Moulmein. They also met with Major-General James Scott (GOC 1st Burma Division). Losing 13th Indian Brigade, Scott was now facing the question about how his two remaining Burmese Brigades would be used. Without Harold Alexander’s input, Slim wasn’t able to say for definite. He admitted that frankly he would like Scott’s men to spend some more time training, both themselves and especially training new arrivals in getting to know, and not fear, the Burmese jungle. Slim was also aware that both Wakely and his men would need translators and local guides. Having some of the Burma Rifles or police on hand would prove very useful.

In discussions among the generals, it became clear to Slim that native Burmans made up a very small percentage of the Burmese forces. Scott noted that his forces (army, police, frontier, auxiliaries, territorials) had over 27000 men, but of that less than 4000 were Burmans. The largest contingent were Indians (over 10000), with substantial numbers of Karens, Chins and Kachins (just under 10000). Scott confirmed what Slim had already been advised by Lieutenant-General Donald McLeod, outgoing GOC (Burma Army), that the political temperature between the various nationalities within Burma was rising. There was a strong independence movement amongst the Burmans, influenced by Gandhi’s Congress Party in India. McLeod’s police had evidence that this was being supported and promoted by the Japanese. There was a real fear that this movement would work at undermining the defence of the country, especially in providing the Japanese with translators and guides. It was even possible that there would be a threat from fifth column activities. All of this made Slim and Wakely keen to enlist Scott’s help to procure reliable locals to support the two Indian formations.

Slim and Wakely were then informed of the existence of the Bush Warfare School at Maymyo officially known as Mission 204 or ‘Tulip Force’. This had been founded to train Australian and British troops in guerrilla warfare for the British Military Mission to China. The secrecy surrounding it came from the time when support for the Chinese was kept as hidden as possible so that there would be no justification for a Japanese attack on the British Empire. Major Michael Calvert was forming his trainees into three Special Service Detachments, or Commandoes. These were all small forces, but available to Slim and Alexander. Calvert was keen on using these commandoes as the Long Range Desert Group had been used in North Africa. The use of irregular troops in the East African campaign had played an interesting role, especially Gideon Force, not one that Slim was terribly keen on, but open to.

Slim was also introduced to the existence of the Oriental Mission, which had been founded in Singapore in May 1941 as the regional headquarters of the Ministry of Economic Warfare. Force 136, as it was known, was designed to conduct espionage, sabotage and reconnaissance in British territories that might be occupied by an enemy. Slim was informed that they were supporting Lt Col Noel Stevenson who had begun to organise levies from amongst the Karen tribesmen in the Shan States. Stevenson had served with the Burma Frontier Service and had extensive experience of working with the Karens. There was little time, few resources and next to no equipment, but many Karens were being organised to keep watch on Japanese movements and to identify Burmese collaborators. These two pieces of information made Slim realise why General Alexander had asked for Brigadier Orde Wingate to be attached to Burma Command.

Slim noted that having some kind of intelligence gathering system would be crucial and made a note to speak to Alexander about setting up some kind of organisation to provide his Corps with timely and accurate information about Japanese activities and intentions.

As he was new to the area, Slim had paid particular attention to the fact that there was a very limited road network and the railway ran north to south rather than east to west. Slim knew the 11th African Division from East Africa and noted their lower-than-normal establishment of motor vehicles. This was a double-edged issue. On one side, they weren’t tied to the roads so much. On the other side, their movement would be generally slower than a Division with the full allocation of Motor Transport. Slim was interested in how both the Burma Brigades, and the Africans were using more in the way of mules for resupply. Looking at the country, he could see the logic of having ‘all-terrain’ means of getting ammunition, water and rations to units.

The logistics of supporting a force in the east of Burma were going to be difficult. The vast rivers that flowed north to south were useful barriers against an invasion, but the limited bridges and ferries hampered supplying the defenders. There was an obvious danger of traffic jams along the limited roads waiting to cross rivers. This would be an invitation to the Japanese bombers to do great damage with little effort. Slim and Wakely would have to sit down with their staffs and work out how best to make sure the men had adequate supplies at all times.

When the problems had begun in Iraq earlier in the year, the initial forces had been flown into Basra by RAF transports. Slim knew very well the importance of air support, not only in defending troops against the enemy’s bombers, and in attacking the enemy’s troops, but also in re-supplying forces in emergencies. The RAF’s weakness in Burma was a real concern, one that needed more bombers, fighters and transport aircraft. This was out of Slim’s hands, but again something to discuss with Alexander when he arrived.

Something else that would need to be discussed was the threat of malaria and other diseases that would hamper the fighting power of the Indian troops. Slim had been informed by Brigadier Eric Lang, (Director of Medical Services) about the struggles to increase the levels of medical support for the growing army in Burma. Slim knew very well that the health of the troops, keeping the men fit and healthy, would have massive benefits, as would keeping up their morale. While getting more men and equipment was always going to be important, looking after the men and equipment already present was just as important. Until such time as all the reinforcements arrived, Slim had to take as much care for the men under his command as possible.

Finally, Slim and Wakely were shown the picture of what Lt-General McLeod’s staff had identified the two most likely routes that the Japanese would take if they did indeed invade. The Southern Shan States were crucial to the protection of the Burma Road to China. The fear was a thrust north eastwards into the Southern Shan States from the Chiengrai-Chiangmai area of Thailand. There were relatively good land communications inside Thailand towards the Burma frontier. Although the routes across the frontier itself were limited to tracks, once inside Burma the Japanese could head straight for the roads on the Tachilek - Keng-Tung –Thazi and the Mongpan-Thazi routes. The 1st Burma Infantry Brigade and the 13th Indian Infantry Brigade were in the Southern Shan States, along with the Burma Frontier Force columns, F.F.3 and F.F.4 protecting that route, with the other two Brigades of 7th Indian Division concentrating at Mandalay from where they could act in defence of the Burma Road.

The other possibility was an attack across the Dawna Hills into Tenasserim, followed by a drive aimed at Rangoon. The 2nd Burma Infantry Brigade, with F.F.2, defended Tenasserim, with significant garrisons at Moulmein, Tavoy and Mergui. This was where the 11th African Division had been sent to man the main line of defence at the Salween River, which was to be held at all costs. Slim’s 10th Indian Division, concentrating at Pegu would back up the 11th African Division. McLeod believed that the difficult border terrain and lack of adequate roads would preclude any serious attack in that direction.

Slim also was informed that the Chinese had offered to send two armies to help defend Burma, the Fifth and Sixth, each about the equivalent on size of a British division but with far less equipment. Auchinleck had accepted this offer but at first wanted these troops to remain inside China but close to the border with Burma where they would provide a reserve until Japanese intentions were revealed. Liaison was established with the Chinese, and it was agreed that one regiment of Chinese troops would move up to the Burma border early in December 1941. This unit was to be available to move into Burma to support the British in the event of a Japanese attack into the Southern Shan States. Auchinleck had agreed for the Chinese 227th Regiment of the Chinese 93rd Division to take over the defence of the Mekong River east of the Kengtung-Mongpyak road, relieving some pressure on Scott’s 1st Burma Brigade.

When General Alexander arrived, there was a great deal to be resolved and finalised. Slim could see some of the potential pitfalls and was reassured by some of his assets. The longer the Japanese delayed invading Burma, the longer the British Empire Forces would have time to prepare. Slim was keen to get to work on making the most of the time he had.

View attachment 781510
Map from
here
Uncle Bill has arrived everyone

Also the Chinese units of the 5th, 6th and 66th Army's were at the time considered to be about 1/3rd the effectiveness of a Allied equivalent call sign so the 2 Army's mentioned are about 2 Divisions worth.

Whether or not that assessment proved to be true or not is irrelevant as the Japanese are unlikely to actually fight them ittl

The UK wasn't bankrupt at the end of WW1. Was it in extreme debt? Yes. It would have been able to service that debt a hell of a lot easier if the following hadn't happened:
1) Post war austerity by the government. Businesses needed to be able to transition back to a peacetime footing, as did the public. Austerity made that transition so very much harder. Austerity ALWAYS worsens an economic recession/depression, because spending money is what drives an economy.
2) Ironically, accepting German war reparations, both in cash and in kind. These placed British goods at a disadvantage because the German versions were practically free in comparison. Why buy British when you can buy far cheaper from Germany.
3) Which just reinforced the traditional viewpoint of the British investment banking sector that it was far more profitable investing offshore. Like, for example, investing in German industries over British ones desperately in need of finance, who thus lagged further and further behind.
4) A lot of that debt was taken up on behalf of, or as a result of acting as a guarantor for, Britain's allies, many of whom either defaulted on, or repudiated, those loans. Looking at you Russia/Soviet Union.

Ditto WW2. Britain had the ability to pay for virtually anything it required or to service its loans, IF it could pay in Sterling. However, the USA would only accept payments in dollars, which the UK ran out of. It still had a shit load of other money though. The US also refused to loan money as per WW1, due to the aforementioned loan defaults & repudiations, despite the UK not having done either, hence Lend-Lease. This brings us to the often overlooked trade clauses of Lend-Lease, which severely restricted British trade both during and post war, and which were designed to financially cripple the Empire, leading to its dissolution and replacement by an American mercantile one. Yay, state sponsored capitalism! Furthermore, the UK is practically the only country from either war that the US insisted pay its debts from WW1 & 2, which it finally did only a few years ago. Hell, even Germany got its WW1 loans forgiven before WW2.
Not only that but Britain also maintained a large military in Germany and Nuclear deterrence right into the 80s and also spent 20 odd plus years 'withdrawing from Empire'.
 

Ramp-Rat

Monthly Donor
What might Britons position be post war ITTL be as apposed to its position IOTL. Note this is just my opinion, and in no way binding our author, who will and should have his own opinions. And a number of posters have raised questions and given opinions, all of which have to be taken into consideration. The first and foremost is will Churchill win the inevitable post war election, to which the answer is no, unless there is a miracle and the war ends in the winter of 1942, Winston is going to be out. However if Winston can be persuaded to stand down as Leader of the Conservative Party, and is replaced by Anthony Eden, the Conservatives might significantly reduce the Labour majority and make it much harder for them to steamroll their policies through the House. Will the new government introduced various social reforms, such as the formation of a Universal Health Care system, major reforms of the Social Welfare system, some Nationalisation of various Industries, and an overhaul of the Education system. To which the answer is again yes, all of these measures had been under discussion pre war, and much of the debate had been over how not if such measures were to be implemented. Remember it was a Conservative administration that had established the Nationalised Central Electric Board, and forced through the combination of the numerous railway companies into the Big Four in 1921. A large number of Conservatives were not ideological opposed to Nationalisation or State control of some industries, where the saw a need, but were opposed to it just for the sake of it. Most of the changes envisioned by Labour, were in the eyes of a significant portion of the Conservatives needed. What was however a source of contention was the method used and the administration envisioned after Nationalisation.

As for the financial situation post war, ITTL or IOTL, it wasn’t as bad as it first seemed, and particularly after WWII, Britain had a number of unseen advantages, it didn’t have after WWI. Unlike after WWI, when Germany and the majority of British industrial rivals in Europe were intact, post WWII Germany and the majority of other European nations have suffered extensive damage to their industry and infrastructure. Britain on the other hand, has other than in 1940 not suffered extensive bombing, and even IOTL the German V weapon campaign was concentrated against London, not the industrial heartland in the midlands and north. Britain had in addition spent considerable monies on modernising much of its industry. Post war IOTL, Britain enjoyed a significant boom, for meany years as the European nations struggled to repair the extensive damage to their industry and infrastructure, and it had only one major rival, the USA. It was a combination of a number of factors that lead to the majority of the problems that Britain suffered from post war, some home grown but the majority originated from America. The failure of the post war British government to prioritise spending on industry and infrastructure, such as Britains railways, and coal and steel industries, plus major cutbacks to research and education, while increasing spending on housing and social welfare, was to my mind a mistake. Agreeing to the convertibility of sterling debt to US Dollar debt, and having a fixed rate of exchange between the US Dollar and the Pound, all helped to enrich the Americans and increase the problems for Britain. Hopefully Britain will be in a stronger position ITTL, and thus able to negotiate a much better deal with America.

Given the last post from our esteemed author, the situation in Burma, is increasing becoming more favourable to the British. The arrival of the battle hardened devisions, and the establishment of a more unified command structure, along with the failure of the Japanese to exploit their initial attack. Along with the decision of the Japanese to concentrate on their invasion of Malaya, unknown to the British at this time. Will allow the British forces to establish themselves and carry out some much needed training in local conditions. And the longer the delay, the harder a successful invasion will become, until it becomes virtual impossible. Yes unlike in Malaya the locals, some of, will be very much a handful, and give the army and administration numerous problems. But unless the Japanese enjoy significant success, and as long as the British are able to retain the loyalty of the Burmese forces and police, with two experienced Indian devisions in country, the British will be able to handle any problems. And as each week goes by and the British/Indian forces become more established, while the Japanese fail to make a significant invasion attempt. The chances of there being an uprising in Burma fade, other than the politically motivated in the cities, the majority will want to keep their heads down and try to feed their families, while keeping a roof over their heads. And an experienced police force, that has not been disrupted by a Japanese invasion, backed up with experienced troops, will quickly be able to deal with any unrest. Plus under fortress rules, and with the Andaman Islands as a suitable holding place, the removal of a few of the more prominent mischief makers, should see the problem dissipate quickly.

RR.
 
30 December 1941. Rangoon, Burma.

The men of 20th Indian Brigade marched out of the port and onto a train to take them to Pegu where 10th Indian Division was being concentrated. The men had been brought to Burma onboard RMS Queen Mary, along with the Division’s artillerymen, engineers and the rest of the men that made up a Division’s fighting ability. The men of 21st and 25th Brigades had sailed on RMS Queen Elizabeth. The two troopships normally ploughed the sea between Australia and the Gulf of Aden. The need to bring the 10th Indian Division to Burma as speedily as possible had meant a detour to Basra. Standing off Rangoon because of the threat of air attack, the men had been transhipped onto other smaller vessels to carry on into the port. General Auchinleck had to fight tooth and nail for the 10th Division to be sent to Burma. With the fighting in Malaya, Percival had been hoping for this Indian Division on top of the recently arrived Australian 9 Division and British 18th Division. General Alexander, newly appointed as GOC Burma Army, had won the argument with the War Office that this Division was crucial to his plan to hold Burma. This, along with Auchinleck’s interventions, had been accepted.

Some of the ships normally used in the Mediterranean between Alexandria and Tobruk and in the Red Sea between Port Sudan and the Suez Canal had been sent to pick up 10th Division’s equipment. These ships, with various escorts, were already in the Bay of Bengal and expected to arrive within the week. Among the equipment was 252nd Indian Armoured Brigade’s mix of light tanks, some well-travelled Vickers A9s and A10s, armoured cars, and 14th/20th King's Hussars’ had M3 Stuart tanks.

Major-General Bill Slim and some of his staff had been in Rangoon for a week trying to sort out all the practicalities of moving and training a Division from one theatre to another. Major-General Arthur Wakely’s 7th Indian Division already had two of its Brigades in Burma. The 13th Brigade had been under the command of the Burma Division. The 16th Brigade was finally complete with all three Battalions concentrated at Mandalay. With the arrival of 14th Brigade, and the Divisional Troops, Wakely, like Slim was trying to get his Division sorted out. The arrival of General Harold Alexander was expected within a day or two. He was currently in Calcutta with General Auchinleck being briefed on the situation, especially about the need to work with the Chinese to keep the Burma Road open.

The other problem that Slim had to deal with was the likelihood that he would be promoted to Lieutenant-General and be put in charge of a newly formed Burma Corps. Slim had requested that General Auchinleck appoint Brigadier Douglas Gracey from 17th Indian Brigade in Iraq to take over as GOC 10th Indian Division. Slim was also aware that a Corps would need a lot more staff that were currently on hand. Auchinleck had negotiated with Wavell to give Alexander help with staff, on top of what he could spare himself from India. Slim had been promised that he would have a proportion of those staff officers when they arrived.

In the meantime, Slim and Wakely had visited Major-General Charles Fowkes (GOC 11th African Division) whose HQ was near Moulmein. They also met with Major-General James Scott (GOC 1st Burma Division). Losing 13th Indian Brigade, Scott was now facing the question about how his two remaining Burmese Brigades would be used. Without Harold Alexander’s input, Slim wasn’t able to say for definite. He admitted that frankly he would like Scott’s men to spend some more time training, both themselves and especially training new arrivals in getting to know, and not fear, the Burmese jungle. Slim was also aware that both Wakely and his men would need translators and local guides. Having some of the Burma Rifles or police on hand would prove very useful.

In discussions among the generals, it became clear to Slim that native Burmans made up a very small percentage of the Burmese forces. Scott noted that his forces (army, police, frontier, auxiliaries, territorials) had over 27000 men, but of that less than 4000 were Burmans. The largest contingent were Indians (over 10000), with substantial numbers of Karens, Chins and Kachins (just under 10000). Scott confirmed what Slim had already been advised by Lieutenant-General Donald McLeod, outgoing GOC (Burma Army), that the political temperature between the various nationalities within Burma was rising. There was a strong independence movement amongst the Burmans, influenced by Gandhi’s Congress Party in India. McLeod’s police had evidence that this was being supported and promoted by the Japanese. There was a real fear that this movement would work at undermining the defence of the country, especially in providing the Japanese with translators and guides. It was even possible that there would be a threat from fifth column activities. All of this made Slim and Wakely keen to enlist Scott’s help to procure reliable locals to support the two Indian formations.

Slim and Wakely were then informed of the existence of the Bush Warfare School at Maymyo officially known as Mission 204 or ‘Tulip Force’. This had been founded to train Australian and British troops in guerrilla warfare for the British Military Mission to China. The secrecy surrounding it came from the time when support for the Chinese was kept as hidden as possible so that there would be no justification for a Japanese attack on the British Empire. Major Michael Calvert was forming his trainees into three Special Service Detachments, or Commandoes. These were all small forces, but available to Slim and Alexander. Calvert was keen on using these commandoes as the Long Range Desert Group had been used in North Africa. The use of irregular troops in the East African campaign had played an interesting role, especially Gideon Force, not one that Slim was terribly keen on, but open to.

Slim was also introduced to the existence of the Oriental Mission, which had been founded in Singapore in May 1941 as the regional headquarters of the Ministry of Economic Warfare. Force 136, as it was known, was designed to conduct espionage, sabotage and reconnaissance in British territories that might be occupied by an enemy. Slim was informed that they were supporting Lt Col Noel Stevenson who had begun to organise levies from amongst the Karen tribesmen in the Shan States. Stevenson had served with the Burma Frontier Service and had extensive experience of working with the Karens. There was little time, few resources and next to no equipment, but many Karens were being organised to keep watch on Japanese movements and to identify Burmese collaborators. These two pieces of information made Slim realise why General Alexander had asked for Brigadier Orde Wingate to be attached to Burma Command.

Slim noted that having some kind of intelligence gathering system would be crucial and made a note to speak to Alexander about setting up some kind of organisation to provide his Corps with timely and accurate information about Japanese activities and intentions.

As he was new to the area, Slim had paid particular attention to the fact that there was a very limited road network and the railway ran north to south rather than east to west. Slim knew the 11th African Division from East Africa and noted their lower-than-normal establishment of motor vehicles. This was a double-edged issue. On one side, they weren’t tied to the roads so much. On the other side, their movement would be generally slower than a Division with the full allocation of Motor Transport. Slim was interested in how both the Burma Brigades, and the Africans were using more in the way of mules for resupply. Looking at the country, he could see the logic of having ‘all-terrain’ means of getting ammunition, water and rations to units.

The logistics of supporting a force in the east of Burma were going to be difficult. The vast rivers that flowed north to south were useful barriers against an invasion, but the limited bridges and ferries hampered supplying the defenders. There was an obvious danger of traffic jams along the limited roads waiting to cross rivers. This would be an invitation to the Japanese bombers to do great damage with little effort. Slim and Wakely would have to sit down with their staffs and work out how best to make sure the men had adequate supplies at all times.

When the problems had begun in Iraq earlier in the year, the initial forces had been flown into Basra by RAF transports. Slim knew very well the importance of air support, not only in defending troops against the enemy’s bombers, and in attacking the enemy’s troops, but also in re-supplying forces in emergencies. The RAF’s weakness in Burma was a real concern, one that needed more bombers, fighters and transport aircraft. This was out of Slim’s hands, but again something to discuss with Alexander when he arrived.

Something else that would need to be discussed was the threat of malaria and other diseases that would hamper the fighting power of the Indian troops. Slim had been informed by Brigadier Eric Lang, (Director of Medical Services) about the struggles to increase the levels of medical support for the growing army in Burma. Slim knew very well that the health of the troops, keeping the men fit and healthy, would have massive benefits, as would keeping up their morale. While getting more men and equipment was always going to be important, looking after the men and equipment already present was just as important. Until such time as all the reinforcements arrived, Slim had to take as much care for the men under his command as possible.

Finally, Slim and Wakely were shown the picture of what Lt-General McLeod’s staff had identified the two most likely routes that the Japanese would take if they did indeed invade. The Southern Shan States were crucial to the protection of the Burma Road to China. The fear was a thrust north eastwards into the Southern Shan States from the Chiengrai-Chiangmai area of Thailand. There were relatively good land communications inside Thailand towards the Burma frontier. Although the routes across the frontier itself were limited to tracks, once inside Burma the Japanese could head straight for the roads on the Tachilek - Keng-Tung –Thazi and the Mongpan-Thazi routes. The 1st Burma Infantry Brigade and the 13th Indian Infantry Brigade were in the Southern Shan States, along with the Burma Frontier Force columns, F.F.3 and F.F.4 protecting that route, with the other two Brigades of 7th Indian Division concentrating at Mandalay from where they could act in defence of the Burma Road.

The other possibility was an attack across the Dawna Hills into Tenasserim, followed by a drive aimed at Rangoon. The 2nd Burma Infantry Brigade, with F.F.2, defended Tenasserim, with significant garrisons at Moulmein, Tavoy and Mergui. This was where the 11th African Division had been sent to man the main line of defence at the Salween River, which was to be held at all costs. Slim’s 10th Indian Division, concentrating at Pegu would back up the 11th African Division. McLeod believed that the difficult border terrain and lack of adequate roads would preclude any serious attack in that direction.

Slim also was informed that the Chinese had offered to send two armies to help defend Burma, the Fifth and Sixth, each about the equivalent on size of a British division but with far less equipment. Auchinleck had accepted this offer but at first wanted these troops to remain inside China but close to the border with Burma where they would provide a reserve until Japanese intentions were revealed. Liaison was established with the Chinese, and it was agreed that one regiment of Chinese troops would move up to the Burma border early in December 1941. This unit was to be available to move into Burma to support the British in the event of a Japanese attack into the Southern Shan States. Auchinleck had agreed for the Chinese 227th Regiment of the Chinese 93rd Division to take over the defence of the Mekong River east of the Kengtung-Mongpyak road, relieving some pressure on Scott’s 1st Burma Brigade.

When General Alexander arrived, there was a great deal to be resolved and finalised. Slim could see some of the potential pitfalls and was reassured by some of his assets. The longer the Japanese delayed invading Burma, the longer the British Empire Forces would have time to prepare. Slim was keen to get to work on making the most of the time he had.

View attachment 781510
Map from
here
Stuff like this is 10/10 to me. Thank you a lot
 
Amin joined the King's African Rifles as an assistant cook in 1946, he played no role in the military until then.
I know that. I once encountered an ex-British officer of the Kings African Rifles who claimed to have pinned a Military Cross on Idi Amin's chest...
 
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