WI slavery is not practiced in the United States?

[The Militant One]

I was watching a CNN special on Africa and slavery. I got me thinking, what if when the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights were being written; OTL's 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments were automatically included with the original bill of rights, creating the "Original 13 Amendments of the Bill of Rights." What type of butterflies would this create? What would the demographics of the United States look like today? Would the African American population be smaller? Would there even had been a civil war? What would the United States appear to be like culturally?

 

[Nitzism]

Well, what were the first 13 states?
New Hampshire, New York, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia right?

During the Civil War, south Carolina, North Carolina, Virginia, and Georgia sided with the Confederacy. Maryland split during the war. Delaware remained with the Union despite being a slave state, and attempted to vote down the 13th Amendment and rejected the 14th.

I'd say the US probably would have been smaller... maybe starting off with New Hampshire, New York, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania as the founding states, and would have likely had a rougher time trying to gain independence.

(Yay me, my first post here since I registered)

 

[Mr Stereo1]

Most of the politicians in the senate were rich, and before industrialisation that meant slaves. Would they really vote away the source of their wealth?
George Washington was a slave owner.

 

[Derek Jackson]

My sense is that most of the men at the Convention were embarassed about slavery, being of the enlightenment but felt that they had to take it into account in the Constitution

Notice the references to slaves 'other persons' and 'held to service'

 

[David S Poepoe]

I don't see the 14th nor the 15th being acceptable at the Constitutional Convention, nor do I see the necessity of them until later.

 

[Lord Grattan]

I was watching a CNN special on Africa and slavery. I got me thinking, what if when the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights were being written; OTL's 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments were automatically included with the original bill of rights, creating the "Original 13 Amendments of the Bill of Rights." What type of butterflies would this create? What would the demographics of the United States look like today? Would the African American population be smaller? Would there even had been a civil war? What would the United States appear to be like culturally?

I seriously doubt that the "slave rights" amendments would have been adopted by the requisite number of states to become part of the Constitution. Had they been, for discussion's sake, then intense and violent civil unrest throughout the nation would have followed. Also, slavery aside, those amendments grant powers to the federal government that the founding fathers and the framers of the Constitution would have found appalling.

 

[thehistorysage]

At the time of the Constitutional Convention in 1787 only Massachusetts and the territories it claimed had entirely banned slavery. So if the question is 'could this have happened?' I would have to say probably not.

If it had though, the effects I think would have been tremendous. You would have a much, much smaller African American population given that the slave trade lasted officially until 1815. In turn the agrarian South likely would have been more industrialized than in OTL as the wealthy land owners focused on more effecient ways to turn a profit than employing huge numbers of white and freedmen on it's large plantations. This in turn may have pushed agriculture and expansion west more rapidly.

With no internal sectarian violence i.e. Bleeding Kansas and the Civil War, and no political maneuvering to maintian the power balance between slave and free states the US may have become even more expansionist than it was. Mexico may have been entirely absorbed. Fifty-Four Forty or Fight may well have gone fight. I don't want to go off on an Ameriwank here, but it's hard to imagine Britain and Canada repelling something akin to a combined invasion of what in OTL were the Union AND Confederate armies.

 

[Philip]

Mexico may have been entirely absorbed.

I really doubt this. Maybe a little more of the northern sections or along the Gulf Coast, but there really wasn't much desire to add that many Mexicans to the voting rolls, etc.

Fifty-Four Forty or Fight may well have gone fight.

Possibly.

but it's hard to imagine Britain and Canada repelling something akin to a combined invasion of what in OTL were the Union AND Confederate armies.

It is also hard to image the US raising an army comparable to the combined Union and Confederate Armies for 54-40 (after all, look at the army raised to fight Mexico). It is even harder to imagine the the US economy surviving the blockade that the RN would enforce. Finally, it is hard to imagine the US being able to deal with both Mexico and Canada at the same time.

 

[thehistorysage]

I really doubt this. Maybe a little more of the northern sections or along the Gulf Coast, but there really wasn't much desire to add that many Mexicans to the voting rolls, etc.

There may not have been a great deal of interest in adding Mexicans to the voting rolls, I'm not aware of any historical sources dealing with that. However, much of the opposition to aquiring Mexican territory was based on Northern anxiety over slave states aquiring more power, which is not an issue in ATL.

It is also hard to image the US raising an army comparable to the combined Union and Confederate Armies for 54-40 (after all, look at the army raised to fight Mexico). It is even harder to imagine the the US economy surviving the blockade that the RN would enforce. Finally, it is hard to imagine the US being able to deal with both Mexico and Canada at the same time.

When you mention a RN blockade, that seems to answer the issue with raising a large US army of Civil War proportions. American nationalism was at an all time high in the mid 19th Century, wealthy Southern Fire Eaters and Northern Abolitionists would have been on the same side of this issue in ATL. Concerned with the loss of revenue a blockade would have caused.