Proof Through The Night: WWII Draka Nukage

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"Proof Through The Night" gets mentioned in various Draka discussions here, but I haven't found a thread of its own.

So I made one. :)

Here's the story:

http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=145479

It's a fun bit of Draka-screw. The only beef I've got is that Eric gives the order to retreat from Spain and it's apparently the first time this order has ever been given in the history of the Domination.

That's a bit much. Even if the Draka won every war, surely they had tactical and even the occasional strategic loss (there's a reference to Madhists obliterating a whole Janissary legion in "Drakas!"). Plus the Draka allow the Germans to penetrate deeply into their lines before pouncing in the Eurasian War, so there had to be (fake) retreats then.

What do you all think?
 
I love the alternate Draka they came up with over there. I have the stories bookmarked. I wished they would've continued them.
 
I love the alternate Draka they came up with over there. I have the stories bookmarked. I wished they would've continued them.

There's a sequel written, but I think it's complete too. At the very least, Julius Rosemont goes full-blown Redemption Equals Death killing the Draka bitter-enders in Madagascar and foiling the Japanese.
 
Yeah, the sequel's complete. I had an epilogue in mind, but after a year of trying and failing to write it I've officially tapped out. There's also "A Different Spirit", set in the far, far future of the same 'verse and possibly the only fic to feature Gwendolyn Ingolfsson as a genuine Good Guy and happy fuzzy Homo drakensis family scenes.

I also have some supporting material and notes on the universe, mainly military hardware, that I can post if there's interest.

Thanks for reading, nice to know someone besides me remembers those things.
 
Yeah, the sequel's complete. I had an epilogue in mind, but after a year of trying and failing to write it I've officially tapped out. There's also "A Different Spirit", set in the far, far future of the same 'verse and possibly the only fic to feature Gwendolyn Ingolfsson as a genuine Good Guy and happy fuzzy Homo drakensis family scenes.

I also have some supporting material and notes on the universe, mainly military hardware, that I can post if there's interest.

Thanks for reading, nice to know someone besides me remembers those things.




-----> INTEREST!
 
Yeah, the sequel's complete. I had an epilogue in mind, but after a year of trying and failing to write it I've officially tapped out. There's also "A Different Spirit", set in the far, far future of the same 'verse and possibly the only fic to feature Gwendolyn Ingolfsson as a genuine Good Guy and happy fuzzy Homo drakensis family scenes.

I also have some supporting material and notes on the universe, mainly military hardware, that I can post if there's interest.

Thanks for reading, nice to know someone besides me remembers those things.

Wow, the actual author is here. Welcome to the board!

There's a lot of Draka material on here, including two lengthy alternate timelines I wrote.

One is entitled "The Dragon and the Bear" and uses a concept originally devised by the board member Hades. Basically Kornilov takes control of Russia in the late days of WWII, pre-empting the Bolshevik coup. He prepares the Russian Republic for the war with the Domination he knows is coming...

The other is "Limited Alliance-Draka War" and depicts the 1951 incident where the Draka provincial governor is killed in France and the resulting air battle spiral into an Alliance nuclear first-strike.

I think you'd like them.
 
If you are interested, you can also check out "Dragon and the Demon" a fanfic done by myself and The Red, where the Resistance and the Draka universes cross over, and the Draka have to unite with the rest of the world in order to survive.
 
Thanks guys, I'll definitely look those over as I get the chance. Work in a software startup, so time for other stuff is limited.

BTW, just out of curiosity, has Proof really come up in discussion? If so, dunno what to say except that I'm flattered and more than a little bit amazed.

I'll look at posting some of the background stuff I have, and happy to answer questions if there are any.
 
It's been used as an example in alt-Draka timelines as a good example of Draka-screw fan-fic as well as a possible useful strategy for anyone messing with the Snakes in the WWII era.

Search the site for "Proof Through The Night" and you'll find the discussions. One of them was "Game On: Tricky Dick 1, The Domination 0" in which the 1971 U.S. is transported into the 1941 Drakaverse just after the Draka conquer Italy. That's got a massive amount of posts and hits here.
 
Thanks man. Guess I'm just egotistical enough to want to see what people thought of it. :) I'm really intrigued by the guy who wanted to avenge Renown, intrigued to see what that's about.

My personal salute to her didn't end up making it into Breaking Strain- the second Reprisal class supercarrier is USS Renown.
 

JSmith

Banned
Yeah, the sequel's complete. I had an epilogue in mind, but after a year of trying and failing to write it I've officially tapped out. There's also "A Different Spirit", set in the far, far future of the same 'verse and possibly the only fic to feature Gwendolyn Ingolfsson as a genuine Good Guy and happy fuzzy Homo drakensis family scenes.

I also have some supporting material and notes on the universe, mainly military hardware, that I can post if there's interest.

Thanks for reading, nice to know someone besides me remembers those things.
Would you post links for the other two?
 
Okay. Here's a quick rundown on the main ship class from Proof Through The Night.

********

From American Aircraft Carriers, 1945-Present, published by the Naval Institute Press

United States Class Attack Carrier (CVA)

As used in Operation Mongoose, 1945
Displacement: 46,500 tons standard
Length: 980 ft oa
Beam: 133 ft wl

Speed: Cruising 22 knots, max 34 knots
Armament: 16x 5"/38 guns in two-gun mounts, 22x quad 40mm Bofors, 30x 20mm Oerlikon, 4x 16-tube chaff/smoke rocket launchers
Air Group: 56: 10x AR-1 Revenant attack bomber, 20x F4U-4 Corsair fighter, 10x F4U-4N night fighter, 8x TBM-3 Avenger torpedo bomber, 6x TBF-1W Watchman early warning aircraft.

Design: The United States class had its origin in the abortive CVB-41 class, a prewar design study for a large carrier with an armored flight deck and a massive air group. Four ships of this design were ordered and allotted the numbers CV-41 to CV-44 when the completion of the Taos Project and the first use of atomic weapons in Europe forced the Navy to reconsider its strategic outlook. After an intense 90-day review process, the General Board decided that the Navy's next carrier design would have to be nuclear-capable for the planned final offensive against the Japanese Empire. The CV-41s were abandoned and a new design begun based on their hull, at the same time as the Bureau of Aeronautics issued a specification of legendary difficulty for what would become the Ryan AR-1 Revenant.

The United States class possesses an enviable combat record and a solid place in history, facts which have often overshadowed the type's many design flaws. The Ryan Revenant was everything it's designers promised it to be, but it was much larger and heavier than anything that had ever flown off a carrier before. Reworking the CVB-41 design to accommodate the massive new birds forced the designers to shrink the island to little more than a stub, place that on an outrigger similar to the ship's two large elevators, and then balance the weight with a tightly clustered and far from optimal 5" gun arrangement. Even so, the class was notoriously difficult to handle in combat or close quarters. Command and control facilities were primitive, forcing the design of a new class of cruiser to act as flagships for nuclear strike task groups.

The Revenant's massive size also made flight deck operations a nightmare- planes had to be brought up one at a time on the elevators, pushed forward, and then fueled while the next was lined up behind them, blocking the deck for an hour or more. The design cried for an angled deck, but there simply wasn't time for the redesign. The timeline for Operation Mongoose was set by the enemy, and the USN would have to make do with what it had. After the war there were proposals to convert the ships with angled decks, but the class simply had too many design compromises. They operated in the deterrent role until replaced by the Reprisal class, then faded away after relatively short service careers.

Of note is that these ships were associated with a heavy attack (nuclear strike) squadron throughout their careers, unlike normal squadrons which rotated between air wings. This was because of the close symbiosis between the carriers and the AR/A2R bombers, which operated almost exclusively from this class.

Service History: Four ships laid down, three completed.

United States, CVA-55. Served as carrier trials ship for Ryan AR-1 Dec. 1944 while still on sea trials. Core of TF 77 during Mongoose for strikes against African heartland, March 1945. Participated in operations against the Gayner Remnant, 1946-7. Transferred to Pacific Fleet 1948, operated in deterrent/strike role until 1955. Transferred to Southern Fleet 1955, operated in quarantine enforcement until 1964. Decommissioned 1965 and laid up. Struck 1974, currently a museum ship in Norfolk, VA.

Heavy Attack Squadron: VAH-2 "Harbingers"
Ship Callsign: Old Glory
Squadron Callsign: Scythe

Reprisal, CVA-56. Completed sea trials Feb. 1945. Core of TF 76 during Mongoose, launching strikes against Draka cities in the northern Police Zone and southern Europe. Suffered heavy damage from Draka air and submarine attack during Mongoose. Abandoned and scuttled by torpedoes from USS Leviathan, March 25 1945.

Heavy Attack Squadron: VAH-1 "Myrmidons"
Ship Callsign: Vendetta
Squadron Callsign: Warhammer

Franklin D. Roosevelt, CVA-57. Laid down as Kearsarge, renamed after President Roosevelt's death in March 1945. Participated in operations against the Gayner Remnant, 1946-7, then operated as the Quarantine Authority's nuclear strike platform from 1948 until 1956. Trials ship for A3R Skysword, 1952. Transferred to Pacific Fleet 1956 and operated in deterrent role until 1958. Kept in reserve and used as a training carrier for heavy attack squadrons 1958-61, then decommissioned as uneconomical to operate and scrapped.

Heavy Attack Squadron: VAH-3 "Furies"
Ship Callsign: New Deal
Squadron Callsign: Nemesis

Crown Point, CVA-58. Cancelled when 41% complete after Operation Mongoose. Scrapped on the ways to clear slip for construction of USS Renown.
 
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I'd like to hear more about the operations against the Gayner Remnant--it seems despite the vastness of the Domination, this was the only territory post-Mongoose that was able to pull itself together.

You've got a timeline (1946-47), so I imagine you've thought about what actually happened.
 
Sure, I can talk about that. One thing to note first: I deliberately ignored the implausibility of the Draka running around with M1 tanks and M16s when everyone else is fighting WWII with the same weapons they did historically. Same thing with their advance through Europe, merrily sacking the Vatican without repurcussions, nobody saying boo when they take over half of Asia after WWI, etc. One of the rules I made for myself was that I would spot the Draka all the B.S. Stirling gave them, right up to the point where the fic started. There's been enough deconstructions of how the Domination would fare in a real world where people act like they actually do, most notably by Mssr. Stirling himself in The Chosen. I wanted to beat those motherfuckers (possibly literally, you never know with Snakes...) on their own terms.

Even with all that, the Draka are a very small minority in their own country. They talk a lot about the good ol' plantation grandpappy had before the Yankees kicked him out, but scratch the surface and they're basically ancient Sparta- small upper class of warriors, huge class of helots treated like dirt. The Draka square this circle by monopolizing industrial civilization and using its force-multiplier effect, along with the psychological effect of sheer mass terror. One of the most revealing scenes about this is in the school sequences of The Stone Dogs, where Yolande et al are in history class and reading about the early Domination and the first serfs- "six shots, and then hand to hand with cold steel". Details have changed, basic operating method has not.

Now come a batch of magnificent men in their AR-1 Revenants and blow their big advantage right the hell up. One of the things I assumed when writing this is that the Domination's industrial base stayed heavily concentrated in the African homeland. By canon settlers are mostly plantation owner wannabes, and you want the factories close to population and raw materials, both of which you have in Africa and not so much elsewhere. You also want them where security's tightest and serfs meekest, because having your expensive machine tooling wrecked by monkeywrenchers or blown up by saboteurs sucks. Sure, you'll teach 'em a lesson, impale everybody in a six-klick radius and their ninth cousins, yadda yadda yadda- but that doesn't help the factory owner much. So you get big factory compounds, near cities so they can get services and transport to move their goods, and since the Draka industrial sector is run by State-managed Combines you probably don't have that many factories for each type of widget, either. Did I mention they're all near cities?

Take away the factories that make their guns, ammo, trains, planes, and other industrial force multipliers, and the Draka are hung in a way that has very little parallel. Spread out very thin, even more so than usual because most of your Citizens are in Europe fighting. Everyday logistic chain gone. And surrounded by people you've spent centuries pissing off. Oh, and if you do hold a significant amount of territory you have to worry about United States and VAH-2 coming to play. Europe's similar, except everyone there has guns. And the Draka forces in Asia are suddenly facing hordes of Japanese with secure rear areas who know all they have to do is run the Snakes out of whatever ammo they have on hand, then finish the job with bayonets and swords. They managed a fighting retreat to India and surrendered to the Brits there...at least, some did. Let's not talk about the rest, hm?

The only exceptions are Syria and Araby provinces, which got some industry in the years after the Great War once they were pacified, mostly because of all the oil there. They also survived Mongoose intact, had a good amount of military equipment in the provinces that was on its way to the armies in Europe and Asia, and also had a leader ruthless, ambitious, and oh so very Draka stupid enough to try giving the rest of the world the finger.

So that's the story of why Gayner's Goons managed to hold out when pretty much nobody else did, because they were in territory that was just industrial enough to keep their edge but not enough to be a primary target for the Alliance's limited nuclear arsenal.

Next post: How we fixed that. Rosemont and VAH-1 are involved, of course. And lots more Snakes getting buckets of instant sunshine thrown on 'em.
 
Thinking about the Draka being Quarantined in Madagascar reminds me of Pandemic 2 in an ironic way.
 
ChaserGrey,

Canonically the Draka's industrial core is the Orange River to Katanga. The southern African bomber force hammered much of it, but a lot of it would be further north and west of the path of destruction. Your story refers to several East African cities being destroyed, but I would imagine a lot of the interior stuff would survive.

Are we operating on the assumption that those areas collapsed into slave revolt soon after Archona and the cities to the north and east bought it?

MTG has an epigraph mentioning a serf religion in the factory compounds teaching that Satan has taken the Draka away--they're really being mobilized for the war--which backs your comments about how the Police Zone was "stripped to the danger point" to support the war.
 
Next post: How we fixed that. Rosemont and VAH-1 are involved, of course. And lots more Snakes getting buckets of instant sunshine thrown on 'em.

I really want to hear about this. :D

The war in Asia also strikes me as being really interesting. By canon the Japanese controlled most of China at this point (with the Draka controlling western China and Central Asia), so we're talking by land area one of the biggest wars in history.
 
Well, damn. I thought their industrial base was much more concentrated in the tip of southern Africa, so that would lead to problems. Of course, United States still had several bombs left over at the end of the story, unlike Reprisal which was scheduled to expend all her bombs on the first two nights. (Three guesses why) So conceivably she could sail back west and hit that heartland afterwards...if I do a Director's Cut, I may have her go that way rather than up the Eastern coast.

But yeah, I was assuming massive slave revolts, and I had that passage from MTG in mind when I thought about it. The Draka have the Police Zone pretty much stripped bare, and by the numbers I thought made sense most of the ones that are left there are the young and old. Throw in some heavy casualties, because United States did get Archona, Cape Town, Diskarapur, and Shahnapur, which I think are the biggest cities they have save Alexandria, and I think you reach a tipping point. We also know from MTG that the Draka have occasional uprisings even in the best of times- Eric's older brother John died putting one down.

More coming on Louise's Loons, promise. As for the Asian war, I didn't have much figured out past the Japanese duking it out with the Draka. Assuming the Japanese work about the same way they did in OTL, they'll have lousy armor, very low infantry firepower, good artillery, and very, very good morale. The Draka are vastly superior in firepower, but they're operating off dwindling stocks and they know it.

If you or someone else reading would like to flesh that out or maybe write a story, I'd be happy to supply notes and look it over. I like the Proof verse, even if I'm out of ideas for it.
 
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